What should we preserve?

While there are limited women in senior leadership positions to act as role models, there are considerably fewer women from diverse backgrounds. The initial overall reaction of the women interviewed is that ‘there is not much worth preserving’, demonstrating a sense of resignation and despair.

This is about having power and Authority on my own country in which I hold sovereignty which is not recognised [SH]

The women acknowledged a slow shift in the culture and gains that have been made over the past decades, thanks to women leaders who had come before them. Previous and current women leaders have paved the way and demonstrated what is possible, highlighting the need for respectful relationships and the importance of leaders having both lived experience and expertise in diversity and inclusion to champion the way forward.

The women that have paved the way to allow somebody like me…[my] background, working class, migrant background, parents who didn't experience high school… to occupy a very privileged position that I now have [NK]

Duré Dara stressed the support that women can offer each other through ‘fighting friendships’, respectful collaboration and asking each other tough questions, which is a foundation to be preserved and strengthened.

Fighting friendships are friendships between women who have a kind of understanding that there are going to be tough questions that they have to ask each other, or they have to push back or push forward. But still moving towards each other because they need so much help in collaboration [DD]

The contribution of advocates with diversity and inclusion expertise and lived experiences of racism was recognised by Mariam Veiszadeh;

…there are passionate advocates out there that are recognising that this is a particularly niche area that needs specific advocacy and expertise…we're starting to see impact [MV]

She went on to highlight the impact of organisations such as Women of Colour who are quantifying the problem and disseminating focused research, and the Victorian Women’s Trust.

I think we're starting to see impact… we're going to have to wait to see if there’s going to be systemic change but we are certainly starting to see a level of impact with a heightened level of awareness and it’s being done because of organisations like Women of Colour [and] other organisations that are starting to quantify what the problem is by putting research out there that speaks to this specific issue [MV]

What needs to change?

The entrenched barriers to equality and inclusion for women in leadership demands systemic change. Women spoke about masculine and European privilege, the need for nuanced understanding and approaches to First Nations and CALD leadership, and awareness of systemic barriers. First Nations women and CALD women are often not visible in senior leadership positions, influenced by societal norms and narratives that value and privilege personal traits and notions of leadership that are not helpful to women, especially women from diverse backgrounds.

I think society still privileges, values, identifies particular traits as leadership, which are associated with how men have led, and a particular type of man [PW]

The narrative of a woman of colour succeeding is not a narrative, you have to create and forge that narrative [SH]

Understanding cultural diversity is also nuanced and complex; the experiences of a woman of European descent will be different to a woman of non-European descent who deal with physical differences when compared with the majority.

It is a different experience to a woman of a non-European background, a woman who’s born in Afghanistan like myself, a woman who’s got a darker skin tone, a woman who has an accent, a woman that has to contend with being visibly and physically different [MV]

This is further felt by First Nations women.

The value of a First Nations person is very low in this country. The value of a First Nations woman is even lower, white men and white women cannot and do not actually see us in positions of power [SH]

These systemic intersectional barriers, including racism, sexism, bigotry, prejudice and biases, oppression, discrimination, stereotypes, structural inequalities, unconscious biases, institutionalised patriarchy and safety concerns, affect women’s capacity and desire to take on leadership positions.

At the core of all of this is patriarchy, sexism, and the ideas that inform that. And then adding to that when we look at other women, women with disabilities, LGBTQ women, women of colour, migrant refugee women…there is racism, discrimination at play, all of those issues, they're big issues, obviously that need to be addressed within the workplace [and] work practices [NK]

There needs to be a recognition that the personal is still political, reconciliation comes from working together, listening together [DD]

The women all revealed their own experiences of workplace discrimination, including within one organisation working in the diversity and inclusion space. As Mariam described:

It’s not because culturally diverse women or people of migrant backgrounds are not ambitious. The challenges that they face in an everyday setting are very different to some of the challenges that someone more privileged is going to face… if you don't have to deal with microaggressions on a regular basis… it’s a lot easier for you to have the headspace to say, I'm going to aim for that leadership position [MV]

Interviewees provided solutions to these systemic barriers being support for diverse women to access and achieve leadership positions. For Aboriginal women, their status, knowledge and power on their lands need to be recognised. Addressing ‘institutionalised patriarchy embedded in the law’ [DD] is necessary at the policy level. Within workplaces, greater flexibility, affirmative action policies spanning employment, remuneration, promotion, opportunities, and engagement, and targets and mechanisms to reach those targets must facilitate equity and inclusion. Several women also described the importance of shifting the language from exclusion and division to inclusion. Greater opportunity, encouragement, mentoring and role modelling for diverse women, who will become role models for future women leaders, is needed. Further, we need to recognise women with lived experiences of racism as experts in both the change needed and the solutions to tackle the problem. Space must be created for them to lead the discussion and decision-making.

…ultimately the problem-solving has to come from people with lived experience. That requires other people to recognize when they don't have that lived experience and potentially either stand aside or open up room to invite other people with lived experience to come and speak about it [MV]

Another theme was the need to better engage with leaders and society about how their attitudes, behaviours and biases can endorse existing inequality and the explicit actions needed to proactively influence positive change. For example, aligned to the ‘fighting friendship’ [DD] concept, women shift from competition with each other to collaboration.

I think the more important thing for us to think about is …within the broader society, how do we engage with men and women who may have a view that equality is a good idea, but don't necessarily see or understand the ways in which behaviours can ratify existing structural inequality? And to talk through, not in a kind of accusatory way, but rather asking how is that? What can they do? [PW]

Similarly, the power that men currently hold and the role they can play to promote equality was noted in several interviews.

…all of us, men in particular, taking some responsibility, recognising that there is, they have a privilege, male privilege and being prepared to work with women as equals [NK]

The responsibility of all leaders to stand up against exclusive behaviour, shift attitudes and use their power to facilitate change and promote normative messages that support diversity was emphasised.

All of us, men, in particular, taking some responsibility, recognising that they have a privilege and being prepared to work with women as equals [NK]

You need diversity around the table. And it’s not just the white men or women, who get to make the rules…because that doesn’t work anymore. It’s time to stop that… [SH]

What does better look like?

The women unanimously agreed that better means diverse women being recognised, included, visible, heard, valued, respected and well-represented in leadership positions across the community, in business, politics, institutions and organisations, as equals.

Whether it is politics, business or the community more broadly, better looks like leadership in our institutions which better reflects who we are [PW]

A culture that very much changes to embrace this, to not be threatened by it, but embrace the value that women and diverse women have to offer [NK]

[For First Nations women] Acknowledging our space on and in our Country as knowledgeable leaders is a start [SH]

Much more diversity of roles and structures of people working together challenging all the structures of leadership - it has to be looked at because it has been encapsulated by one culture [DD]

This can only be achieved when the disadvantage that comes with diverse identities is recognised, understood and accepted as a societal issue and responsibility.

…there is an acute awareness that your diverse identity does mean a level of disadvantage and that we don't have to convince people of that, that people can just understand that, that it’s an expected fact that this is problematic and society’s brought on a journey to kind of just get that, ‘This is wrong. This crap’s happened in the past, people being mistreated and it’s wrong and we need to do better.” And there’s less resistance, there’s less resentment, there’s less kind of, “Why are people of a particular identity getting a leg up” [MV]

The women reflected that better means systemic coordination and cooperation to shift societal culture, norms and practices to promote gender equality, equity and collaboration.

…gender equity, the pay, affirmative action to ensure that women are equally represented. I mean, that’s it, we need those targets and we need, better looks like women being equally represented [NK]